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07.14.08, 12:46 PM General Topics
57 replies
We are such babies about gas prices. Time for us to grow up. The second we have to pay prices barely approximating what the rest of the world pays, thereby requiring us to discipline our enormous consumption, we come up with the grand idea of lifting the ban on drilling. An idea that some people actually believe is good or even ballsy! [ Reply | Watch | Flag ]
General Topics 07.14.08, 12:46 PM Flag
 

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I agree. I could get a car & drive 20 min to work, but I use public transportation & it takes 1 1/2 hours. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 12:47 PM Flag
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What about biking it? My commute from Brooklyn to Manhattan is 1+hours via car; 1:15 via MTA; 45-50 min via bike. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 12:50 PM Flag
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you bike in the snow and rain? do you have a job where you have to look presentable the moment you arrive? [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 12:51 PM Flag
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yes. no. I change at work but in previous jobs I had a membership to a gym and showered/changed there. About the same time to do it there versus at home. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:05 PM Flag
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np: I also drop off my dd and carry a computer and bag with papers, etc-so all that would not fit on a bike! Wish I could though [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:07 PM Flag
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come on. If you wanted to do that you would make it work. There are bike trailers to transport kids. Or children seats for bicycles. Just look what other folks in European countries do. They bring their children, their briefcases etc. No problem. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:13 PM Flag
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ita. the dutch have it down to a science. quite frankly, there are so many other options. remember when people used to carpool to work? but to say that it's too expense to maintain our current habits so let's go destroy the environment even further, well, i think op is right on in ridiculing that. oh wait...i'm the op! [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:15 PM Flag
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No, honestly, it is too many miles across really difficult territory. From the North Shore of SI to the Center would take me at least 3 hours each way. I already take a bus and have to walk part of the way- the walk alone is difficult. The hill I walk up is black ice in winter- some parts are not doable by bike. I mean, sure, if I was Lance Armstrong I could do it. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:16 PM Flag
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You do it for a year or two and you will realize how easy it actually is. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:17 PM Flag
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Dude- are you even listening? [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:18 PM Flag
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yes, I am but you are discouraged way too easily. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:21 PM Flag
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Honestly, I can't imagine biking for 3 hours to work and then having to change. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:23 PM Flag
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np ditto. That is just nuts. Things aren't that dire [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:25 PM Flag
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cyclist again: Figure you can cover about 10 - 15mph (with starts and stops and a not too aggressive pace to start.) If you have no desire, then ignore this -- but if you are wondering, it is a lot easier than you would think. What happens is you do it a few times, it gets easier, you find new routes, maybe make a riding buddy or two. Pretty soon, you are jonesing to ride more. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:31 PM Flag
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cyclist: the computer and papers issue are not insurmountable. Papers are easy, computer I'd probably just leave one at each location. Especially considering how cheap (and fragile) computers are. If you are not a comfortable rider and/or live in an urban environment, transporting your kid via bike is not a great alternative. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:18 PM Flag
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I work at home some days so have to carry it both ways. I ride the bus, so using public transport is pretty good, no? [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:20 PM Flag
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I advocate cycling because I find it such a great way to interact with the world. Not just because it is an environmental plus. Yes, Mass Transit is good, it is great. (What I did when I started commuting is ride one way in the morning, leave my bike, take mas transit home and then mass transit back the next day and ride home. So, I got my ride/workout in every day but didnt have to do it 2x per day.) [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:58 PM Flag
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It's unbikable. I live on Staten Island [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:06 PM Flag
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Bike to the ferry, and from the ferry to work. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:14 PM Flag
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I live and work on Staten Island. I would have to bike across an expressway, through the Greenbelt- it would take hours and hours [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:17 PM Flag
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Is SI included in the mayor's effort to make NYC a bike-friendly city? [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:18 PM Flag
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sure, but SI is notoriously corrupt and incompetant in actuallizing urban planning. It's not the forgotten borough for nothing [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:20 PM Flag
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to whoever cares: the NYC bike map: http://www.nyc.gov/html/dcp/pdf/bike/mapback.pdf (This side has Staten Island. If you replace back with front in the URL you'll be at the other side of the map.) -cyclist [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 02:13 PM Flag
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and probably costs oodles less [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 12:56 PM Flag
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It would take me about 3 hours each way- also across a major expressway and up major hill ranges- just not possible [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:08 PM Flag
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see? Just like OP said. Babies (LOL) [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:09 PM Flag
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Yeah, maybe I should wake up at 4, get a bike with a baby seat and a side car for my computer and bags, then bike for 3 hours in non-bike friendly streets. Then get to work and change, but still be sweaty and tired, and then do it again on the way home. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:18 PM Flag
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see? That's the spirit! Save the earth and all that crap! We should all live like they did in the olden days. I am currently riding a bike generator to provide electricity to run my computer. I grow all my own vegetables in containers on the roof and wear recycled paper towels for clothing [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:21 PM Flag
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how much time did you put into the route search? Nothing, right? I am very sure that you will find an easy "bikeable" route. Going up and down hills? Well, that is part of using a bike. You will get used to it. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:15 PM Flag
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I take the bus, and to be honest, I'm not really interested in biking to and from work for 3 hours each way. If it was doable in 20-30 minutes, sure. I have looked at the route- some bike clubs do the trip to where I work once a year, but I'm not a cyclist. I can't bike for 6 hrs a day! Sorry! [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:22 PM Flag
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I completely agree--but then again, we don't own a car. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 12:51 PM Flag
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ok. I agree that we need to work on alternatives. Fine. But what should we do in the meantime? Drilling for oil we have here makes sense. China is making deals with Cuba as we speak to drill close to our shores. I'd rather it was us out there than China. Remember all the recalls this last year or 2? Do you really want them out there? I don't understand why people think this is an either/or game. We can drill for oil AND work on alternatives. Right? [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 12:56 PM Flag
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first, us drilling is going to have zero impact on china's decision to drill. it's not an either/or on this score. second, the more opportunity gov't has to focus on drilling rather than on alternative energy, the more procrastination there will be to put meaningful effort and resources into alternatives. that we consider further desecration of the environment to be an option is the very problem. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 12:58 PM Flag
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you are right about China not stopping b/c we drill. I mistated that. Sorry. But - why should they be out there getting the oil that we could be getting too? Makes no sense. And I do worry about their ability to do it safely! Maybe we can get up and running faster and beat them out of some of it at least. I think eveyrone realizes that we need alternatives. But, if gas goes up to $10 a galllon, it will really cripple the economy. I think people are working on alternatives. I'm not opposed to tax breaks for research etc to encourage more of that too. I just don't see it as an either/or situation [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:02 PM Flag
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I agree with this. It's one of the reasons I like living in NYC--built-in environmental good. We live in smaller spaces, don't drive as many cars, have steam heat for whole buildings, etc. Recently I've wondered about all the people w/second homes in NYC, though, having a whole extra place to keep up that they don't use much. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:00 PM Flag
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wondered what? [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:05 PM Flag
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The rest of the world is used to high taxes and pay a sh!tload of those when they fill up the tank (there was a great NYTimes article a few days back). The increase in gas prizes is easily buffered in high tax countries and therefore they don't see such major increases like here. All that said, I think it is GREAT that many people start complaining about the prices. And the attitude that they should just look at what other people in other countries pay for gas is wrong. People should be discouraged to drive. Discouraged to waste natural resource. Encouraged to find alternatives. They should not make peace with high prices. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:12 PM Flag
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so how do you do that? WHo gets to decide what gas costs? [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:13 PM Flag
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the government should tax the hell out of it [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:16 PM Flag
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personally, I don't like giving teh government any more power than I have to. It already far oversteps it's constitutional bounds IMHO [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:17 PM Flag
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the oil shortage is a national (even global) issue and the government has all the right to step in. Since this is a capitalistic country the only way to control habit is to target the pocketbooks. What do you think about the cigarette or alcohol taxes? [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:21 PM Flag
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don't like them. I think taxing should be to raise $$ to perform valid functions of gov't. Period. I don't like using taxes to control behavior. This is supposed to be a free country right? [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:22 PM Flag
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np - taxes do both! and considering all the negative health repurcussions of over indulging in drinking, smoking and gas consumption, i think it's perfectly valid for the government to tax impose high taxes on it. of course, they should be taxing those company profits as well. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:25 PM Flag
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LOL! You do realize that corporations don't actually pay taxes dont' you? They just pass that cost along to us. Any thoughts on the fair tax? I love it [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:26 PM Flag
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and we as customers accept those higher prices or not [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:30 PM Flag
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very true. I am a big believer in teh free market. I think that will take care of most problems all by itself without cumbersome corrupt government getting involved [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:31 PM Flag
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Ha ! you're the Libertarian I've spoken to before ! [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 02:14 PM Flag
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wait. free as in anybody can do whatever he pleases? The government has no right to tell you to take it easy with those cigarettes or with your gas consumption? [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:29 PM Flag
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afirmative. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:30 PM Flag
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you know that pure laissez faire is a recipe for disaster? It assumes that every individual is able to make the best choice possible anytime anywhere. Unfortunately, this is very far from the truth and therefore government has to step in and regulate and provide guidelines. What those are is, of course, debatable. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:35 PM Flag
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I'm not talking total hand off. I'm saying I don't like the gov't using taxation to control behavior. I think it's fine for the gov't to promote good habits with PSAs etc. I think the CDC etc are a great use of tax dollars. I don't like laws that govern what I can do in my own home. I'm not even a pure capitalist. I think child labor laws are a pretty good idea! I just think that the gov't has gotten waaaay too intrusive and spends far more $$ than they ought to. I think we should vote out every single last congressperson and senator we have and start over. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:38 PM Flag
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Yes, but Europeans pay so much for gas because it is so highly taxed. At least they are getting social services for the money they pay for gas. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:23 PM Flag
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Good point. Fondly, S. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:26 PM Flag
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Hi! I'm an oldtimer (used to use the initial K at one point...nice to "see" you. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:37 PM Flag
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exactly ! I would happily pay more in taxes (and I am in the highest bracket) if it meant better and universal health care, better services for the elderly, guaranteed education, etc. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 02:16 PM Flag
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I don't think it's so much the price that is so bothersome, but how quickly it went up. No time for adjustments when many people are already living check to check. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:26 PM Flag
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People seem to cope somehow. The high gas prices are definitely changing habits. That's a good thing. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.14.08, 01:31 PM Flag
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