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07.05.08, 15:18 PM NY Schools
36 replies
who are these people who want to do away with zones? I would never want that or support it. would only serve the people who move to an iffy nabe to buy a huge space, and then get all the benefits of the good zone. would not make sense for the entire system to be one big lottery! [ Reply | Watch | Flag ]
NY Schools 07.05.08, 03:18 PM Flag
 

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No. It wouldn't, but the lottery system should be independent of where you live. The lottery system is not accomplishing what it was designed to anyway as it is. It is actually decreasing diversity in the good schools because only a certain type of person has the time and education to manipulate the system in that way. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 03:20 PM Flag
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are you saying there should be no lotteries? if yes, i agree. if you are saying anyone should have access to any school regardless of where they live, then I disagree. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 03:25 PM Flag
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I am saying that the lottery is a failure. It should be changed or done away with. I think there should be allowances in all schools for special circumstances. I think that the failing elementary schools should be divided up and changed just like they are doing to the high schools with more magnet type situations for specific needs. There is a huge problem in most districts with few options for parents in poorer districts like 5 and 6. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 03:30 PM Flag
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The situation is impossible to fix. They should dismantle the entire system and start from scratch, they have been discussing ways to improve public city schools for 50 years, nothing has worked nothing will ever work [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 03:34 PM Flag
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I am or above. They are dismantling high schools to some degree. It needs to happen from the bottom up. There are all of these new high schools but nothing to offer options for elementary school or to fix the failing schools. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 03:39 PM Flag
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It has been going on in discussions forever and they have tried various fixes which do nothing, I just have no faith that it will ever changed having lived here for 46 years. Top to bottom, bottom up, it just all needs to be dismantled [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 03:42 PM Flag
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Education is a cycle that starts with the parents and their level of education. I guess things will just continue as is without a massive overall. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 03:45 PM Flag
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I believe it will just continue on like this, like a body with two broken limbs. I have never seen any solution even come close to improving anything. My god Wagner is still a prison! [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 03:48 PM Flag
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I disagree. what good would that do? there should be zones, so that kids can go to school in their nabes. there should be gifted programs in those schools for kids who need them, and do away with lotteries and citywides. that way, people will stick close to home and fix the schools or move that would improve schools and/or get rid of the excess of kids. burbs will flourish and nyc will return to normal. its not the only place t live, and those with kids who cannot afford pricey nabes will either fix their local schools or leave. that is the way it is done everywhere. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 03:44 PM Flag
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Back to normal? How long have you lived here [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 03:49 PM Flag
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I have lived here since the age of 10. I went to private schools, but now have the pleasure of the public ssytem. I think there are more and more kids seeking placement in elementary than when I was growing up. we need a mass exodus to the burbs, and the best way to accomplish this is to do what I said. get rid of lotteries (will happen, since the schools that used to have a bunch of lottery spots no longer do), make citywides district wide, and put G&T programming in all the schools. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 03:53 PM Flag
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I grew up here too, knew nothing about the public system until three yrs ago and then scrimped to send to private because the schools were so depressing. More dcs? so the census says but not anymore dcs with the income to send to private than when we were small. Mass exodus is not realistic though, much as I would love to see it [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 03:59 PM Flag
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So curious, how did you go to private and now end up sending dc to public [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 04:07 PM Flag
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people like you keep saying that, but there is a change. My parents were physicians, and we went to private. My dh is a physician, and we cannot afford private. the financial structure of nyc has changed, adn I do believe there are more MC/UMC people sending dcs to public school. there are not enough good ones, and so people are calling for changes that will allow them access to more citywides, G&Ts or lottery spots. I say stop it now, and push people to send kids to local schools which they can improve, or people can move to the burbs. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 04:23 PM Flag
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people like me? do you mean people with experience with all of this? yes. and my parents were physicians as well, and my dh is a surgeon we can afford private and the makeup of our dcs class is much as it was when we were there socially and economically. Incidentally, I am surprised to hear as a native that your experience was not similar. Sounds fishy [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 04:26 PM Flag
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lol! fishy? [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 06:12 PM Flag
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Do you want all of the teachers to leave too. Most can't afford the nabes with good schools. Why should all the good schools be in affluent nabes, anyway? You can't fix a school a huge school as a parent. Principals aren't forced to listen to you, and you may be a lone voice in a voiceless population. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 03:51 PM Flag
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then move. My family knew many teachers back in the day, but to answer your question, I think teachers should be given special consideration as part of their package. otherwise, people can move out. The city has too many kids to accomodate, and it cannot be fixed, unless some leave. that is obvious to private school parents and should become obvious to those who but big apts in washington heights or riverdale or harlem, and then expect to go to school in D3, or elsewhere. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 04:00 PM Flag
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OR from above: I like the moving suggestion. I think all these people should move and give me back my city too d$mn crowded [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 04:03 PM Flag
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it would also prevent people from flocking to the 'good' zones before their dc starts K, which is what happens in the 41 and 234/89 zone. We live in chelsea and I know at least 10 families who moved to the village or tribeca so they could send dc to those schools. I actually pay more in property tax (and zoned to a so so school ) than someone with a similar property in the west village. Why shouldn't my dc have the same if not more of a right to attend the 'better' village school? The property taxes in NY are not assessed based on school zones [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 04:41 PM Flag
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yes, but it was your choice to choose the pricier area with worse schools. people need to live with their choices and improve the schools in the areas they choose. why should I live in a tiny 2 br hovel near ps87, and have people with 3-4 bedrooms in morningside heights coming into my school? sorry, I don't buy it. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 04:49 PM Flag
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you do realize that that person with the bigger apartment in morningside heights is funding more of your dc's school than you are...what is fair about that? Until the BOE can guarantee an equally good education to everyone in the city the 'good' schools are going to be overcrowded. Doing away with the zones would definitely alleviate some of the overcrowding in the 'better' schools and it would force people who would have otherwise gone to the 'better' school into the 'borderline' schools and they would improve. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 06:16 PM Flag
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I doubt the tax thing you claim. my maintainance (and tax) is huge, and much higher than the all the apts we looked at in morningside heights a few years agon. you could never get rid of zones and bus kids all over the city. it is not feasible or desirable from a financial or environmental standpoint. people can choose to buy in my nabe a much smaller apt if they want to attend the school...just like we did. i think this idea of letting people live wherever, and then letting them pick a lottery number to determine schools. would be completely crazy to do this. also, you realize I hope, that we are not talking about a way to incorporate the poor. we are talking about how to let the MC live in cheaper areas, but still get the schools in more $$ areas. I would never support that move, nor would anyone else in these nabes. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 06:31 PM Flag
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depends where you live. I looked into it...we live on a block that is zoned for commercial use, therefore we pay more property tax per square foot than we would if we lived on a block zoned for residential use ...taxes in NYC are not based on what school you are zoned for. Maybe they should be....that would be fair...could bring more $ into the entire system that way and improve it for everyone [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 07:09 PM Flag
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Not AT ALL. That would make the system even more unfair. The schools in the poorest neighborhoods--which are more numerous than wealthy neighborhoods--would be a disaster. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 07:10 PM Flag
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ITA! [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 07:13 PM Flag
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all of manhattan is commercially zoned. every building has commercial space for stores or doctors' offices or whatever. trust me the taxes on the uws are high high high. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 08:30 PM Flag
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Actually, if you had a district wide lottery, it would do a lot to improve all the schools in a district by balancing the population by race and class. It would also alleviate the price gouging real estate prices in certain neighborhoods. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 07:13 PM Flag
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no, it would be unfair to people who sacrificed space and other amenities to buy into a good zone. if you want space, go to the bubs and enjoy the great public schools there. otherwise move to our zone, and live like we do. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 07:15 PM Flag
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how much do you pay to live in your "good" zone and what zone is it? [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 07:16 PM Flag
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Exactly. I have friends who wouldn't move to m zone because--God forbid--their kids would have to share a room and now they want to use my address (where my kids share a room) to get into our zoned school? I don't think so. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 07:17 PM Flag
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this is what kills me. all the people calling for a no zone lottery system likely have much bigger apts and a better QOL in terms of living space. or they have rent controlled apts they don't want to leave. meanwhile the struggling MC who values education made the sacrifices necessary to put their kids in a good school, only to have these people trying to make it all equal access for everyone. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 07:46 PM Flag
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what do you pay for a 2 br hovel near ps 87? [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 07:17 PM Flag
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About $4400. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 07:24 PM Flag
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Now that your children are in a "good" school, you could move to a bigger cheaper apartment in a "bad" zone. [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 08:54 PM Flag
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btdt. prefer proximity to the school, and the nabe, though less interesting is certainly more convenient [ Reply | More
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General Topics 07.05.08, 09:22 PM Flag
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